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Discussion starter · #101 ·
Hook up your Volt Meter just like you are doing Duty Cycle.
Key On, Engine Off you get 70% or 85%?

Then manually pull the linkage ALL the wan with your hand and see if you get the WOT signal on your DVOM (which is some other percentage like 10, 20 or 40, can't recall).

This will confirm you just have a linkage problem (like we all had, or have or will have).
Tom/Jono,

Tried this and got 85% with key on and engine off. Pulled the throttle and no change. So does that mean faulty EHA? With the engine running it jumps to 99%-100% so I believe that's a fault code.

Mike
 
Discussion starter · #102 ·
With the engine running it jumps to 99%-100% so I believe that's a fault code.

Mike
I had thought that you had good DC readings at idle and 2500rpm and all your basics were done. Ooops. I misunderstood.

#1 first priority is to get the engine systems running 100% to spec before trying to beef up the power. I lived with the factory CIS troubleshooting manual for months testing and verifying every little component. WOT, AF Pot, Temp sensors, O2 - All those inputs to the computer need to be spot on.

CIS is a complicated creature: Electrical inputs, Mechanical inputs, Thermal inputs, Pressures, Kinetics, and that all-important cone the plate lives with.

Print out those factory sheets and go top to bottom.
Wish we were in the same town, its kinda fun to dial all that stuff in.
 
Discussion starter · #104 ·
Interesting read on Duty Cycle measurement using DMM regarding reversing the polarity on the pins. I have to do it to get 85% KOEO (Key on engine off). I have a late model California model and my LED light on the 92X connector does not go on. The manual tells me that I need to hold the reset button for two-four seconds to get it into Lamda on/off mode. I think this is why I am having problems reading the duty cycle because the the CIS-E controler in not switched to on/off ratio output.

Mike

Sears Multimeter #82139 for Duty Cycle Check - PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum
 
A helpful thing to have is the MB Service Manual printouts with the CIS Electrical Troubleshooting charts.

Use these charts to cross-check your readings.
This helped me determine how to use my Sears DVOM.

Find your 70% or 85%.
Check your full throttle switch and make sure that shows you 20%.
Push the airflow plate and you should see 10% (Then maybe 40%).

Once you cross check a few of these you will know for sure you are connected properly.

I have 1% the experience of the smart guys like Jono.
So double check my math and report back problems.
Study hard!
 
Discussion starter · #106 ·
A helpful thing to have is the MB Service Manual printouts with the CIS Electrical Troubleshooting charts.

Use these charts to cross-check your readings.
This helped me determine how to use my Sears DVOM.

Find your 70% or 85%.
Check your full throttle switch and make sure that shows you 20%.
Push the airflow plate and you should see 10% (Then maybe 40%).

Once you cross check a few of these you will know for sure you are connected properly.

I have 1% the experience of the smart guys like Jono.
So double check my math and report back problems.
Study hard!
Tom,

Thanks! This has been my daily read for the past few days. Just can't figure out why the LED does not come on at the 92x test connector. I should be able to determine fault codes by the number of LED Flashes. Thanks again for help.

Mike
 

Attachments

Tom,

Thanks! This has been my daily read for the past few days. Just can't figure out why the LED does not come on at the 92x test connector. I should be able to determine fault codes by the number of LED Flashes. Thanks again for help.

Mike
Hello trooper6,

Sorry for this slightly off topic question, but I checked out the pdf file that you attached, and was wondering if you would know where I might be able to get this data for my KE-Jetronic equipped for my M119.960.

Thank you in advance,

Chicky
 
Tom,

Thanks! This has been my daily read for the past few days. Just can't figure out why the LED does not come on at the 92x test connector. I should be able to determine fault codes by the number of LED Flashes. Thanks again for help.

Mike
Maybe there aren't any Faults?
It can run like shit and not detect any errors. Its not very smart..

My 1988 doesn't have that system (70% car).
 
Discussion starter · #109 ·
Just stumbled across Tom's fantastic CIS-E tunning thread. Seems like I am on the right track just have to figure out my 0%, 100% DT codes and lower my AF mixture. I will also be ordering and installing a Wideband O2 sensor for tunning. Just have to figure out where to put it since I have an airbag where my glove compartment should be.

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w126-s-se-sec-sel-sd/1527280-cis-e-diagnostics-cel.html

Thanks again Tom and Jono!!!

Mike
 
Hope it helped you. I got good results when I finally dialed everything in.

Seemed hard at the time, but with lots of studying and stealing data from the Alfa, Porsche and other websites I got a good handle on it.

If only my Triple DCOE Webers on the Z were so easy!!
 
They sound amazing!

But CIS-E is easy compared to 6 throttle bodies.

Driving my SEC this weekend and it pulls great, but GAS-HOG is a mild term. YOW.
A/C vent blower cutting in and out is my next project after JONO sells me some spare lowering springs....
 
Discussion starter · #113 ·
Ok, I am back in action and now have a DC @ 30%-40% at idle. Over the last couple of weeks i made it to the Chula Vista Pick Your Part and scored (2) Cal CIS-E controlers, (1) ECU, (1) EZL and a bunch of other spare parts. The main reason I went was to get back up controllers so I could diagnose my DC reading problem. I also replaced the O2 sensor. Anyway, I finally figured out how to get my California CIS-E to output the on/off duty cycle. I basically had to hold the button down longer than the 2-4 seconds noted in the manual. My LED should have come on and flashed once, but it never did. LED may be burned out? I held down the #2 button and watched my meter and saw DC % after about 10 seconds of holding it. Now I was able to do all the prescribed trouble shooting and AF adjustments. Now I have 30%-40% DC at idle. With the IOEO (Ignition ON Engine Off) my DC drops to 9.9% when the intake plate is pushed then returns to 40% when release. The next thing to buy is an AFR gage then off the to Dyno. Thanks again guys!!!!!



Mike
 
Good stuff.
Do that again, and while the car is running just like in the video, take the airflow plate and push it down just a little bit. Your percentage numbers should briefly go Lower. Just another way to confirm you are reading correctly.

When you increase RPM to 2500 what does your DC do?
Curious to see that.

I have an evil number of posts...
 
Discussion starter · #115 ·
Tom,

Here you go! Looks like it goes a high as 50ish @ 2500. With the engine off starts at 40% then drops to 9.9% when the intake plate is pushed.



Do you think the range between idle and 2500 is too wide?
 
Engine Off and Key On you are at 70% or 85%, Correct?
Anything else is an error.

Then you push the airflow plate and you see ~10%, when you release it you may see 40%. (if you move the plate around you may see 70% again).

With Engine Off and Key On still you back to 70% or 85% and you floor the throttle from the cabin you get 20%? Release and return to 70% or 85%?

I know we've talked about it, but do you see all those results each time?

My SEC is setup for Max Power (Minimum economy!).
To get the AFR I wanted on my Wideband while driving my DC readings were opposite yours.
50% at idle (+/- 5% = 45-55)
35% at 2500rpm (+/- 5% = 30-40).
This is adjusted with minor changes in the little screw on back of EHA and then returning to the idle mixture screw and resetting that for 50% idle and then re-check 2500 and repeat as needed.

The results of this *FOR ME* was 14.7 for all driving except WOT when the WOT switch hits (That 20% signal) and I got about 11.8AFR at low rpm and 12.6 at redline. Dyno runs showed this was about max power setting.

Unfortunately the shape of the cone that the airflow plate rides in is not ideal and contributes to non-linear mixture as RPM increase. Solution is re-machining the cone, fabricating "ramps" to attache to the cone to alter the airflow at various RPMs or some electronic solution like a switch that inhibits the WOT switch until after 4000rpm which would help flatten the fuel curve. Not an ideal solution to the nonlinear fuel flow with RPM.
 
Discussion starter · #117 ·
Tom/Jono,

Today was a fabulous day and was able to fix my issues with the DC. I want to thank you both for helping me through this with your spot on information. I had to regroup since my last post and try to figure out just what the heck I was doing wrong. Basically, I had to step back and re-read all the previous information I had along with Tom and Jono's responses to my thread. Tom’s last post really set me straight (see below).

Engine Off and Key On you are at 70% or 85%, Correct?
Anything else is an error.
Answer: 85%

Then you push the airflow plate and you see ~10%, when you release it you may see 40%. (if you move the plate around you may see 70% again).
Answer: 9.9%

With Engine Off and Key On still you back to 70% or 85% and you floor the throttle from the cabin you get 20%? Release and return to 70% or 85%?
Answer: No change from 70%


Well at least know I know what my problem is. Basically my EHA is not getting a signal to enrich the fuel mixture. So I propped my gas peddle down with a tool case and was able to get it to stay all the way down with the kick down switch engaged. Now I went back to the engine compartment to see if the full throttle stop was engaged and verified that it was not. I remembered that Jono replied to my throttle linkage question and said to inspect the secondary linkage to see if there was too much play in the linkage directly behind the FD. If so, pop it off and hit it light so that it does not move any more. This looks basically like some kind of spring cylinder device that has lost its ability to recoil back. Because of this I was not able to get full throttle. I could manually push the linkage the balance of the way and engage the full throttle stop. Just as Jono stated, I popped the linkage off, hit it with a hammer to swage/compress it so that it no longer has play (see photo). I popped the linkage back on, removed the items used to engage the throttle in the full throttle position and voila 20% DC when the throttle is fully engaged from inside the drivers compartment.

Now that my full throttle issue is back on track, my next issue it that it is still running lean DC of 60% at 2500 RPM. Per Tom’s advice, now I am focusing on adjusting the EHA to run richer. So now I put towels around the FD to soak up fuel that will spray out when I loosen the two screws that secure the EHA to the FD. I removed the connector and loosened the screws and as expected, fuel sprayed out. I then removed the EHA being sure not to loose the green orings or the two EHA mounting screw. The EHA has a brass slotted screw that must be removed to get to the 2mm allen head adjustment screw (see photos two and three). I adjusted the EHA ¼ turn to clockwise to make is richer. After that I reassembled everything in the reverse order.

Now I measured the DC at idle and it was extremely rich at around 16%-22%. I then leaned it out to get 50% DC at idle. Now the moment of truth, I raised the RPM’s to 2500 and now get a DC of 32%-39%.


Now for the test drive. This is a completely different car that has finally come to life. At full throttle it continues to pull past 5K rpm with neck wrenching power. My previous dyno runs and trouble shooting revealed that I never had full throttle capability and was running lean at higher rpms. I can’t wait to get back to the dyno now. My previous dyno yielded 204 RWHP running lean and no full throttle. Hopefully I can get near the 227 RWHP mark that Jono stated he got with a similar set up.

Thank you both!!!!!
 

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Discussion starter · #119 ·
Nice! Excited to see the results.

What mods you have now?
American motor with Tri-Y and good fuel flow? You aren't a hi-compression motor are you?

Cool!

Tj
Nope, just a well taken care of .968 9:1 motor. I will be installing FGS (First Gear Start) tomorrow and continue to fine tuning. Thinking of a 2.82 rear end later on.

Mike
 
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